HOW TO BUILD WORLD-CHANGING PARTNERSHIPS WITH JEAN OELWANGFeaturing Jean Oelwang, Founding CEO, Virgin Unite; Co-founder, Plus Wonder

Jeff [00:00:02] Hello, I'm Jeff Walker. Welcome to System Catalyst, the podcast that cracked the code for making the world a better place. One of the taglines of this show is we can't fix the world alone. We say that because we firmly believe that the only way to solve the world's biggest problems is through partnerships. And when we say partnerships, we're talking long term partnerships that both strengthen and grow over time. In other words, those that can change the world. Easier said than done, right? I mean, people change. Issues change. And the more partners, the more complicated it gets. Well, don't worry, because on today's show, we've got a partnership expert who will set you up for success. Gino Wong is founder and CEO of Virgin Unite, the philanthropic arm of the Virgin Group. A couple of years ago, she wrote the book partnering, which compiles all the lessons she's learned from her own experience and from dozens of interviews. Today, she shares some of that wisdom with us. She even tells us the story of when she embarrassed herself in front of a U.S. president. So if you're a young changemaker who wants to collaborate more, or a veteran system catalyst who wants to strengthen existing partnerships. Listen up. You'll learn a lot from Jean Olewang.

Jean [00:01:30] Hi, Jeff.

Jeff [00:01:31] So you you started with working in Virgin Mobile, right? And different countries around the globe and then became a different kind of partner. How did you first connect and then how did you get into the role at Virgin Unite?

Jean [00:01:43] So the first part of my career was mainly helping start mobile phone companies in different emerging markets. But then I took what I would call disruptive detours. And I was a Vista volunteer in America with homeless teenagers, which probably was the biggest learning lesson I ever had in my life. And then I moved because I was excited to learn about the kind of not for profit environmental sector. So I went to work for the National Parks and Wildlife Foundation in Australia. And then I got a call from Virgin and they said, would you come help us start up a mobile phone company in Australia? So I pivoted back into the corporate sector, and then I was acting co-CEO with with a fantastic partner at Virgin Mobile. And I overheard Richard talking in the car one time about wanting to do more philanthropically. So I, went home and built a business plan and sent it to him. And, I'll never forget standing in Australia, in Sydney. And he called me on the phone and he said, let's do this. And I hung up the phone, danced around the house. And that was really the start of Virgin Night, which is literally next year, 20 years ago. And so I found replacements and then moved to London, and then we started unite.

Jeff [00:02:54] Wow,m love that. So true entrepreneurship within the organization, which is, rare, you know, being able to come up with a brand new idea and have an organization you're part of saying, good, let's go for this. He had trust in you, I guess. Right? Or he was a classic entrepreneur or that what did he see?

Jean [00:03:13] Yeah, I think I think one of the things I've learned from him is having that trust in people, having that belief in people and just taking risk and being willing to kind of embrace something new and a big idea and getting enthusiastic, excited about it, and then kind of building that momentum. And he's absolutely brilliant at that.

Jeff [00:03:33] Then you started Virgin Unite and grew it. And you've had, you said, up to 19 collections of collaborators over the years, you know, from the elders, you know, onto the African Collaborative that we've worked on and a variety of other things. So, you know, talk to us about, you know, the general role that you play as a system catalyst. Talk about how it all kind of strategy wise looks to you.

Jean [00:03:58] Yeah. And it's been a really interesting journey, Jeff, because I think in the beginning we had about 25 businesses in different, about 15 industries. So we were very focused at the start of unite. And how do we embed purpose at the center of them? And then we started to think about what were the systems we wanted to change. And one was definitely around conflict, peaceful conflict resolution because we felt like unless you have conflict resolution, you can't really do anything else within that country. So we were very fortunate. Richard and my boss, Richard Branson and Peter Gabriel had an idea called The Elders, which was around, you know, bringing together a group of global leaders that would work on behalf of humanity with no other agenda, but that of people and the planet. And then that kind of kicked off and that ended up being this amazing group of, 12 global leaders, everyone from Kofi Annan to Mary Robinson to President Carter, that really came together as a collective to work behind the scenes to help resolve conflicts, but also to drive systems change, whether that was around, how do we relook at the UN Security Council? How do we look at, for example, ending child marriage? So they kind of took on and right now they're very focused on existential threats. So pandemics climate nuclear. But that was kind of the first collective of leaders we got off. The ground and we learn a ton around that one around what we did right said authentically collaborate. And then we kind of looked at other systems that we wanted to change, and the next one was around environment. So we started something called the Carbon War Room, which merged with Rocky Mountain Institute. And that merger was a good example of systemic collaboration, where the two coming together are now ten times the impact that each of us had on her own. Really, our role in unite is we're the catalyst. We we come up with, not come up with the idea because we usually partner to come up with the ideas. We pull the idea together by listening to a ton of people all over the world. And then we take that idea and we bring together a group of partners around it. So we've never done anything on our own. Every single one of these has been a collaborative effort with amazing partners like Omidyar School, Elmer Hall, you on the Africa Partner Collective, a whole host of them. And then we bring in a great management team, best of the best in the world. We spin them out to become completely independent. So no one's biased. You can get in the middle of changing what they do so they can. Only, as my friend Andrea always says, only work on behalf of the universe.

Jeff [00:06:30] After two decades leading Virgin unite. Jeanne has become an expert in building movements and partnerships, and in some cases, she learned those lessons the hard way.

Jean [00:06:42] One of the groups that we learn a ton from is we spent the last five years really studying the community who protected the ozone layer, and they were great at having an open tent. So bringing in all kinds of voices, but also really good at determining if someone was actually in the tent, but really focused on blowing up the tent of removing that person. And I think that was a lesson I had to learn along the way. And I made the mistake, probably in the early years of often thinking I have to keep everyone in the tent, and not realizing that sometimes there's some people that are actually going to undermine the initiative. And how do you to have the courage to remove them from the tent? But in saying that, too, I think one big lesson lesson that we learned early, early on when we were doing The Elders is, you know, I had Jeff come from the corporate sector. You know, I spent 18 years building mobile phone companies around the world. So when I first came to Virgin Unite and Richard was like, okay, we're going to start this elders, you know, I went away and spent like three months, like on my own, perfecting this PowerPoint presentation, thinking this is what the idea is going to be. And, and I remember going into that gathering with my perfect PowerPoint presentation and, the first night, Richard and Peter saying, no PowerPoint presentations. We want this to be really intimate. So I remember all night staying up and creating these flip charts and, I'll never forget, like, sitting in front of this room of many of my heroes and sitting in front of this room with my flipchart. And I can remember President Carter sitting, you know, maybe about ten feet in front of me. And his piercing blue eyes were just staring at me when I'm doing these flip charts and I'm thinking, this is amazing. He loves this idea, this brilliance. And then at the end, he stood up and he said, I don't believe in this idea. I don't think it's going to work. And I literally Jeff wanted to just, like, melt into the cement, never come back out again. And I remember looking at the back of the room and seeing Richard and Peter and their faces, it just fall under the floor. And I remember after that we all scurried into Richard's office and we were just silent, you know, we didn't know what to do. And, and then we kind of pulled ourselves together because we had such belief in the idea in each other. And we made this big change where we threw away the PowerPoint presentation. We went out into the room and we really authentically listened and co-created with everyone that was in that room from all over the world. And we did that for those two weeks. And you had Carter and, and Tutu's sitting there for hours creating the values and the purpose. And I can tell you when we left after that two weeks, that idea was a trillion times better than the idea that we went in with. And, you know, years later, when Carter was in his 90s, he, he stood up at his, farewell drinks to the elders, and he said that this was one of the most important things he's ever done in his whole life. I tell you that long story, because it's the story of really how we learned to authentically co-create and how we learned that it was really about listening to the people who understood the issues. And we never, ever made that mistake again. In the subsequent 20 years, we always made sure that we truly co-created, and that's what has built initiatives that have lasted this long.

Jeff [00:10:10] So learning points would be, I don't have all the answers that I need to co-create with my partners and listen. But do you still can provide leadership? You can provide some assistance to help them work together to follow up as they leave the room, and that they have other priorities of their own. But you keep them focused on what they set as a priority as a team. As you can tell, I'm a big fan of jeans and I thoroughly enjoyed her book partner in it. Gene interviews over 65 successful partnerships to find out what makes them tick. She found a few common traits.

Jean [00:10:54] I really became focused on two questions some 20 years ago. One was, how do we build these deep connections in our lives? And a lot of that at the time was a personal journey for me. And the second one, it was really around. How do you then take those deep connections and ladder them up into big collaborations? So a big part of the book was also interviewing the ozone community for the last, whatever, six, ten years. Talking to people like Larry Brilliant that were part of the community that helped end smallpox in India, talking to a whole bunch of people that were part of bringing down apartheid in South Africa. And what we found in all of these collaborations was this group of deep connections at the center. Yeah, this is a super important point, and I think one that people miss because they think we're just going to bring together a bunch of people. It's going to be magic, and they're going to work together for years, and we've never seen that in any of the 20. There has to be a ton of what I would call connective tissue in the background to make something really work and really sing and most importantly, really last for the long term. And so like if I look at the role and I, we learned a lot from, again, the community who did the ozone work because they had something, a lesson that I really always think about now and taking up in my heart, which is start and strengthen, is get a small group of very committed people together that are there for the long run, and they're going to work through the hard moments. They're going to be there. And, you know, in a decade's time, after you've gone through all those ups and downs and, you know, have the organization really working in sync, the other things we've learned is how to make sure that roles and responsibilities are really clear at the center of these initiatives so that people are, you know, not just coming up to be there, but they're coming up and they're going to not be anonymous. They're going to be conspicuous. So they're going to actually do things that actually deliver. And the other thing that's really important is having a lot of celebrating moments of incremental moments. I would call them because I think sometimes we make those mistakes where we just set these moonshots that are almost impossible to reach. And so these collaboratives fall away because it's disappointing. Every time you get on a call, you're thinking, we're not getting there, but celebrating those incremental steps that you can see you're taking to that moonshot, that eventual moonshot that may take, you know, beyond our lifetimes. But then two things that I hadn't expected that were really important, and one was what we ended up calling magnetic moments, where that really thoughtful traditions, rituals that brought people together and kept them connected, like our, you know, weekly calls during Covid or like with the elders, them coming together. We interviewed the founders of Airbnb, had one they called elephants Dead Fish and Vomit, where they brought their team together to have really open, honest conversations about the elephant in the room no one was talking about, and the dead fish that everyone was talking about, no one was doing so anything about, and then the vomit of things. People just needed to get off their chest. And they talked about how that built trust to have that open conversation. But the other thing that when we did the interviews that was really central, that we hadn't expected was what we ended up calling Celebrate Fiction, because none of them were devoid of friction. They all had friction, every single one of these partnerships. But they created tools to lift above that friction so it didn't destroy their partnership. So that one became really central.

Jeff [00:14:22] You got that just in case. Here's a short list of what Jane found in all successful social change partnerships. Number one, how a tight knit and committed group at the core of your partnerships. Number two, make sure each person's role is clear, invisible. Number three, celebrate the small victories as much as the big ones. Number four create opportunities for people to voice their concerns. Number five have regular gatherings or magnetic moments, as Jean calls them, to keep everyone together. Speaking of meetings, so your gatherings have become a bit historic in whether it's the audacious prize or, you know, figuring out, you know, ways to bring people together for these discussions, how do you use that gathering capability and people who trust you so they'll show up? But if it's not interesting, then they won't stay, right?

Jean [00:15:19] Yeah. And I think those gatherings, one of the most important things is that those gatherings are in a place that allow people to step away from their day to day, because you want to be able to build trust in a place where they're not going to be distracted. And, you know, maybe they once said this beautiful thing which. This builds, you know, every day on the hundreds of different actions that we have and how we show up in the world. And, you know, one of the people directors of Virgin Group used to say that we make or break our culture and every single interaction we have. So it's the million magic moments. So I think it's that consistency and showing up with that sense of purpose and that clarity of purpose. So when people come together to gather, they're almost lifted immediately away from their egos or away from their every day because they're excited about that intoxicating purpose of why they've come there. And I think the second is how you curate the group that helps you bring people together, like with the audacious ideas. We were so lucky. You know, Chris Anderson from TEDx was amazing. At the center of this, Jeff Skoll was amazing. At the center of this, as we're a whole bunch of partners.

Jeff [00:16:30] Maybe define audacious.

Jean [00:16:32] Yes, Audacious Projects was an idea that came up through Chris Anderson, through richer, through Jeff, through a bunch of folks who came together, and they decided that they wanted to allow philanthropists to have these opportunities at a big play. So not just say, you know, a couple million, a few million, but in the 100 million range that they could fly and then do what they knew how to do and really drive some massive, significant change in the world. So that was kind of the premise of the idea. And just to see Jeff, it was beautiful with that one, to see the group of about ten funders that came around him in that very first audacious, just how excited they were as well. Like watching Richard, it was one of the most exciting moments because he wasn't doing it by himself. He was doing it with this group of ten other funders who were extraordinary individuals with and also, you know, with Ted, with Chris, who then were able to communicate it in a way that none of us could have done through the TEDx community. So it was that kind of that collective of bringing together those pieces and having the right people at the table, but also having the right voices at the table, like the Andrews at the table, the other people from the front lines that actually understand what's happening and letting them be the ones to run with it.

Jeff [00:17:46] So it seemed to work. So people keep wanting to come back. Right? So trust is there is a process there, but it learns and grows too. So it all kind of connects with each other. But we're learning along the way. You talk about these local actors, Andrew Young and some others, you know, how do you find who the proximate leaders are that can be exposed to these donor collaboratives?

Jean [00:18:11] Yeah. Thanks for bringing up this word proximity, because I think it's probably one of the most important things we all want to learn. And, you know, I think yeah, we learned a lot from Bryan Stevenson, who kind of was the first one to start using that word in a significant way through each eye. And the work that he does with prisoners on death row. And, you know, I my whole life was changed by listening to him speak at Ted the first time and, you know, learning about proximity and getting proximate to the prisoners, as Brian does, has been an amazing shift and proximate to people who live in poverty. And so I feel like, proximity is such an important thing for us all to learn. I feel like like with Andrew, for example, he took a group of us on the ground in Rwanda to get proximate with the smallholder farmers so that we really understood what was being funded, what was happening. But I think it's important to do it in a way that he did, which is one of respect. Where there's partners on the ground, the smallholder farmers are equal partners. So we're not going there. As I think often you see poverty, tourism, what I would call where people are just going to observe rather than going to authentically listen. And I think the other mistake we all make sometimes is that we go and we're not really there to authentically listen. We're there to think of how we solve problem. And it's not about us solving the problem. It's about the people on the ground having the solutions that we can then give them the power to actually scale. And so I think there's a difference in in how we get proximate. I once interviewed Cornel West and Robert Georges and Robert George's. If those of you know him as far right, Cornel West is far left. Couldn't be more different on so many views. But they have this beautiful partnership. It's what they call spiritual friendship, even though they have deep divides and deep differences. And when I ended that interview, they said to me, go out and find a friend that unsettles you. So I think in the sense of proximity, it's not just thinking about the people that we love to be with and that we get along with and that we're like, it's thinking about who do we get proximate to that is radically different than us, that has radically different views than us, so they can help us learn a different way. And so I would couple that proximity with this beautiful phrase that they shared with me, friends that unsettle you and put the two together. And I think that's what's really going to help us change the world, especially in this time of division right now.

Jeff [00:20:37] So imagine you're a young changemaker. Could be in a corporate nonprofit. One of the fellows or out of an MBA or MPP program who wants to partner with others and focus on an issue. What's their first step? Do they just say raise their hand and I'm going to do this, or what do they do?

Jean [00:20:54] Yeah, I think they I think they need to first find what, what I would call not just the fire in their belly, but the bonfire in their belly. So what are the things that are really going to make them passionate? And so I think it's first like thinking about what is that fire in your belly and not not being so tied to it that it can't evolve over time. So I think that's a really important part of it. I think the second is really, you know, taking that advice from Cornel West and Robert George and thinking about who are those friendships that are going to make you feel uncomfortable, who are the unlikely partnerships that you're going to want to bring in the tent? And then thinking about who you need to get around the table, like, who is that right mix to start off the partnership. And I think really pausing and you know, I think sometimes right now we we've been so focused in our lives on thinking of hyper individualism that we've pointed people away from one another. So I'd say to people that are thinking about collaborating, really changing the lens of how they look at partnerships and not thinking about their partnerships of what they can get from that partnership, but thinking about what they can give back to the world through their partnerships. And that will change the dynamic of how they bring those people into their lives. So doing that relationship reset. And I think the other thing I would tell them is have joy, because we have a long road ahead of us right now. And I don't know about you, Jeff, but I'm seeing so many people who are becoming despondent and becoming overwhelmed, and we don't have the luxury to do that. We are in positions right now. We need to continue this fight. And so I think having that resilience and partnerships are going to give us that resilience, and they're also going to give us that joy, that ability to want to keep on going. And we can't lose that.

Jeff [00:22:38] So joy and play right. I've seen whatever your interviews and it talked about that. So how do you integrate. You know the fun part of this.

Jean [00:22:47] Yeah. I think we take ourselves much too seriously and, from, you know, all the 65 partnerships that we interviewed for the book partnering, what we found is they all didn't take themselves so seriously, but they took the work seriously, and they weren't afraid to be silly, and they weren't afraid to be the one bringing that joy into the room. And, you know, I think sometimes we think, oh, joy just has to be spontaneous, you know, otherwise. And sometimes you have to bring in some joy that's perhaps manufactured in the beginning and then becomes this moment of lightness. And, you know, we did that with the Africa Partner Collective. I don't know if you were in that call where at the end of the year we always did this karaoke event and, you know, people brought a different side of them into it. And it sounds so silly, but it's those moments where you can open up that space. People can have fun together, and you have to be the you have to be the one that's willing to take that risk and open that space. Because I think, again, we we take ourselves far too seriously. I can remember, when I first started Virgin, coming from corporate America, I went to Richard with this agenda for our gatherings that started in the morning at 730 and ended at six, and I packed in all this content, all these different speakers, and this is amazing. And he just ripped it up. And what we do now is from eight in the morning to 12 at lunch, we have contents and speakers, and then we spend the afternoon doing things together that are playful and fun, that really allow us to get to know one another. And I can tell you, those afternoons have changed the dynamic incredibly about how we all work together and partner.

Jeff [00:24:35] That's it for today's show. Please don't forget to subscribe to System Catalyst so you don't miss out on the new episodes. Also, do us a huge favor by reading our podcast it leaving us a review. Thank you so much for joining us, and we'll catch you all in the next episode. Before we go, I'd like to thank our producers at human Group media. We'd also like to thank our incredible network of partners who are supporting our mission the School Foundation, the Aspen Institute's Aspen Global Leadership Network, Echoing Green, Dr. K Foundation, Maverick Collective, Virgin Unite, she released their own Africa outreach project, Boldly Go philanthropy, senior goes for Global Nexus and New Profit. If you're interested in becoming a system catalyst, you'll like to learn more about our partners. Please visit System catalyst.com.